Elitism – People taking away choices from other since the Start of Time. Steve started this ball rolling with his post about Jeanne Dietsch (“NH Democrat Jeanne Deitsch – Elitist White-Tower Snob“) when she made it clear that a lot parents would be losers when and if they decided to homeschool their children (especially if they were carpenters):
“This idea of parental choice, that’s great if the parent is well-educated. There are some families that’s perfect for. But to make it available to everyone? No. I think you’re asking for a huge amount of trouble,” Dietsch said.
… “If the dad’s a carpenter, and you want to become a carpenter, then yes — listen to your dad.
It was clear that she had never been acquainted with Hoof and Mouth disease because of the disconnect between her mouth and her brain when saying this – and later, more. Again, at the sake of being repatitive, I don’t want the Right to silence the Left, I WANT the Left to keep talking and talking and then talk some more because we then get to learn what is behind the mask and their outer presentation of their crafted facade.
Well, Neil Dietsch waded into the discussion and I spun off a “Promoted from the Comment” post to show everyone that it was a family snob affair: “Promoted From the Comments – the Elitism Is Strong Within Her…..and Her Brother“. But Steve’s newest post, where Jeanne Dietsch confirmed all doubt (“Jeanne Dietsch Wonders If Voters Really Wanted What they Wanted – Repeates Points That Lost Her Re-Election“) and made it clear that humbleness is not a strong suit.
Nor, is it Neil’s. That latter post reminded me that Neil CONTINUED to show his matching Elitism commiserate with his sister’s back at Steve’s first post. So, I figured I should complete the circle and put it on fuller display. In essence, it comes down to “Who Chooses?” and I closed my previous post, in part, with this:
And that’s the difference – the Collectivist attitude versus the one that I hold in which people have the Freedom to make their own decisions – rightly or wrongly. Elitism vs Live Free or Die. One says I will take choice from you because I cannot allow you to make bad decisions – the other says you get all the choices available (but you must own the consequences thereof) You and your sister apparently have no problem in removing that Choice from them in order to save them from themselves.
Absolutely, I hate the idea of letting ANYONE, Right or Left, near the Levers of Power if they believe they know better than others and therefore are ENTITLED to force everyone to live the way they tell them to you.
Well, then. Neil decided to wade in yet again. And like any good Elitist, notice how he changes the framing so as to limit my argument about who chooses:
You miss a big point. We are talking about choice WITHIN the context of the public school system, which is subsidized by taxpayers. Nobody objects if parents want to go send kids to private schools and pay for it themselves.
The problem is you want to have your freedom, but you want taxpayers to pay for it. Legislators (and the executive branch) are elected to be stewards of the people to ensure that you have an educational system that works and is financially sustainable. (Whether charter schools are a good idea or a monkeywrench that sabotages the public school system is debatable policy that I won’t wade into.)
So be free as long you are willing to pay your own way. But if you want to avail yourself of public services like public education, you should recognize that elected legislators (the agents of taxpayers) have a responsibility to weigh in to see that our tax dollars are used to fund educational systems that serve the public interest. You give up certain rights when you start operating on other people’s dimes (that is, taxpayer money).
Choices are only for you within the parameters and framing they define – in this case, only Government Schools matter. Note that if you accept that framing, you’ve already lost the debate; don’t do it (additional emphasis added here):
You miss a big point. We are talking about choice WITHIN the context of the public school system…
And there you go, proving my point again. ELITISTS want to make the choices that individual people should be able to make for themselves. You have no problem in taking those away – just like your sister. Your level of Statism is showing as well – proving that Progressives believe that the only public good can come from Big Government.
De Toqueville much?
No, you don’t. Instead, you are of the mind that all children must be in Government run, owned, and staffed schools. Worse is the nuance that those Govt schools are ENTITLED to our tax monies.
The status quo, even as we see that NEAP scores show that schools are doing crappy jobs in doing their main mission at higher and higher costs, must be protected – and the teachers unions that receive the money.
No, education monies, by right, should follow the child with the parents making the decision for THEIR children – and not funneled to a particular building within a zip code.
The point is that Society has agreed thus far (according that the nebulous “Social Contract” that Progressives keep yammering about but never show us copies thereof) to educate our children. It doesn’t have to be in a Govt school (unless you are of the side that loves Monopolies, which it seems is true). Just the fact that you assume that charter schools are the equivalent of monkeywrenches shows us your Elitism.
Again, Government schools are FAILING to adequately teach children just to get to the PROFICIENT level.
You give up certain rights when you start operating on other people’s dimes (that is, taxpayer money).
No, Statists have taken AWAY those rights and refuse to give them back because of the “We know better than the parents do”.
And you’ve now proved my point by squaring the circle your sister started.
Thanks for playing!
Still not letting go of his shovel, he proves his Big Government bona fides yet again – it’s almost like once one has joined the Collective, they can never envision that others hold other opinions that should be considered to be as valid as their. Think “mind blinkers” as wide as a barn door:
You want the taxpayer money and the freedom to spend it as you choose on whatever you want.
Call me elitist, but I when I watch so many right-wing supporters crowd into Trump rallies without masks or left-leaning college students who party with equal abandon, it makes me question whether there is the judgment there to make the US educational system competitive with other first world countries.
You do realize that nearly all of the first world countries that rank ahead of us in educational performance have highly centralized education systems. Ours is one of the most decentralized; you want to make it more so.
As to your concept of freedom and the upcoming election, I’ll part with this quote from the patriot Samuel Adams,
“Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt. He therefore is the truest friend to the liberty of his country who tries most to promote its virtue, and who, so far as his power and influence extend, will not suffer a man to be chosen into any office of power and trust who is not a wise and virtuous man. We must not conclude merely upon a man’s haranguing upon liberty, and using the charming sound, that he is fit to be trusted with the liberties of his country. It is not unfrequent to hear men declaim loudly upon liberty, who, if we may judge by the whole tenor of their actions, mean nothing else by it but their own liberty, — to oppress without control or the restraint of laws all who are poorer or weaker than themselves.”
So, to dissemble that hot mess:
So, I’ll ask the Bruce Currie question to which he never can or will answer (less he spoil his Socialist Narrative): Whose money is it first? You make it seem that it is Government’s, that they get the first and largest tithe.
And getting down to brass tacks – it more rightly should be called publicly FUNDED education and not “public education” which defacto means Un-Liberty. If it is the parents money to begin with, Liberty means they should have the choice to direct how their child is to be education. See, this is the chasm between you and I – you and your Elitist sister believe, like Hillary and MSNBC Commenter / host Dr. Perry, that children are a collective asset. Which in practice, more and more, lessens the Parental responsibility and Right to determine what is good and necessary for their own Children. I’ve seen this pernicious attitude from Education Administrations and staff/teachers as well.
You do realize that nearly all of the first world countries that rank ahead of us in educational performance have highly centralized education systems. Ours is one of the most decentralized; you want to make it more so
What I do see is Elitist trying to centralize education – how do you think Common Core came about in ORDER to centralize curriculum?
You’ve also admitted the central problem in the US Education system – it does suck and it sucks badly. Yet, you and your sister cling to the ideas that what isn’t working for the US as a whole should just be made MORE mandatory, Bigger, and more costly – and still get the same results.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over but expect different results.
In this case, denying competition within this sector. By denying the Freedom to try other means. By denying that Parents care MORE about their children than you or your sister or the Edu-Industrial Complex with its Union First attitude. By denying that different children learn differently and rejecting that the late 1800 Prussian school warehouse system still works here in the US.
So, yes, I DO wish to make it even more decentralized. After all, Life all around us is decentralizing in almost different aspect and we live far better than our ancestors ever did. It is just the Elitists (and in this case, educational bigots) that believe only they have the right ideas – all others should be rejected.
Even as the results show them to be dead wrong.
As to your Sam Admans quote – he’s right. One can pass all the laws you want but that doesn’t ensure Liberty and Happiness. In fact, I say he’s right and the severe Safetyism and draconian now implemented around the country due to COVID aren’t leading to Liberty (as they certainly aren’t the wisest).
He rightly points out that it is the people, “we-selves”, that make the difference – their spirit in sustaining the idea of Liberty and Freedom.
I want that people had more liberty in their choices; you are all about keeping choices, a proxy for Liberty, away from them. Your own words betray the basic meaning and message in that quote.
In this, you are the perfect example, again with your sister, of what Sam was warning us about. The fastest purchase to Tyranny is led by those are sufficiently busybody minded to demand that we obey their “good intentions” for us all.
Heh! The people DID vote wisely – they threw here Elitist butt out of their lives.
Never accept what is thrown at you – always join the fight. Or they will get to dominate.
And for Neil’s benefit, I’m thinking that his sister’s remarks, twice over, helped push the NH Red Wave over that tipping point and flipped it for the quadfecta.
You never wanna tick off “the people”. Now I just hope that the new set of Legislators keep in mind that Liberty, Freedom, and Choice come first in everything they do.